As Huawei’s technology portfolio expands into operating systems, computing platforms, and AI models, the company’s intellectual property strategy is evolving with it. Alan Fan, VP and Head of the Intellectual Property Rights Department, explains that Huawei’s longstanding approach centers on supporting its core business and delivering high-quality products. But as the company now builds platforms that others develop on, its IP strategy must also protect and strengthen these broader ecosystems. Discover why patents remain a stabilizing force in this insightful conversation.
Steve Saunders:
Do you want some of the people to go away, or does everybody need to be here?
Alan Fan:
They're all friends.
Steve Saunders:
Okay. No problem.
Alan Fan:
I don't care.
Steve Saunders:
I know you don't care. People really want to know what Huawei is doing, so let's remember that and give them that energy and that we're happy to share that.
Alan Fan:
Okay. Yeah, we are.
Steve Saunders:
And you saw the questions?
Alan Fan:
Yep.
Steve Saunders:
Okay. I changed them all. No, don't worry. No, I'm kidding. Can you tell me what Huawei's overall strategy is for intellectual property development?
Alan Fan:
The Huawei IP Strategy is always to support our business, and our core business is to deliver the best products and services to our customers. Maybe in the recent years there's a little bit of a change because as the company grows, some of our products and services are not just for ourselves. They're becoming part of a bigger ecosystem. So maybe part of our IP strategy will also extend to protect the ecosystem that we belong to.
Steve Saunders:
What do you mean by ecosystem?
Alan Fan:
For example, we're building our own device operating systems. We're building our computing systems where other developers will build their applications on top of our device operating systems or our computing systems. So they're new ecosystems growing on top of our products.
Steve Saunders:
I know that you're patenting some AI technology, but AI is a little bit different, isn't it? To say a technology like 5G, I mean, it's a little bit more abstract, and I think the patent law may be in some ways may not have caught up with the nature of AI. Do you agree with that and how are you handling it?
Alan Fan:
I agree. In totality, I agree. When it comes to AI, it goes beyond the patents. So we actually have to think more about copyright, for example, other forms of natural property where the content or become relevant. Because if you're training large language models or other all kinds of models, you need content, you need substance. So I think, and traditionally, the patents are used to protect the hardware, the structures.
So sometimes they can to be used to protect the software, but they have limitations. And when it comes to AI, there isn't much even software code to protect because much of the thing are just waste. They're just data. I think actually our industry are still exploring the best way to protect or incentivize the AI, so to say technology or business.
Steve Saunders:
I mean, it seems extremely complicated and challenging. Very abstract. I mean, is Huawei going to license its patents to make money from AI?
Alan Fan:
Right now, no. But when we say AI patents, the purposes of these patents are not for really licensing for money, and so they're probably already open sourced. So they're meant to protect the ecosystem. If somebody will come in and want to copycat your whole ecosystem, then these patents could be used to defend yourself. But otherwise, whoever wants to be part of the ecosystem wants to do their business within the ecosystem, they're free to use, like open source.
Steve Saunders:
Last year you published 37,000 patents. That's an extraordinary number, isn't it? I mean, how many of those are contributions from outside of Huawei and how many of them are internally developed?
Alan Fan:
I think very small portion of our patents are results from corporations. We do have corporations with universities, but it's just a small part of our patenting. So our patent, the majority of the 37,000 is still to protect either our products or some of these standards or ecosystems. So these are mostly home-made, home-originated patents.
Steve Saunders:
What's the biggest challenge for you in terms of maintaining your patent portfolio?
Alan Fan:
Right now, I think the biggest challenge is as the company comes into some of these areas that we're becoming the leader of the market and other companies would follow on, want to copycat their technology. So wherever you are doing great, wherever you're doing best, then they will come and wanting to make a replicate products so that they can somehow take some of the market share. So I think that's where the challenge is, because we're really doing well in some of these areas. Not all of them, I would say, but in many areas, that we're doing very well.
Steve Saunders:
It makes your target when you do well.
Alan Fan:
Exactly.
Steve Saunders:
Okay, good. I hope so. A philosophical point here, we're living in a time of great change in society around the world, and also a lot of geopolitical conflict. But the IP and the patent industry still seems to operate as a sort of peaceable kingdom. You may have terrible conflicts going on between different countries, but the representatives of the patent communities still talk to each other, don't they? They still exchange information. That hasn't changed at all. That's still the way?
Alan Fan:
When it comes to patenting, especially between larger companies, there is a professional circle where people really know each other and talk to each other. So generally they have to respect each other. Otherwise, they would be an outlier. If you are managing IP business, you better respect IP, otherwise you would not doing this for long. So I think there's a general common understanding that we have to operate based on principles, based on rules of intellectual property instead of always trying to resolve things, issues through politics. Because when it comes to politics, it's also should be known as kind of a bias, because why don't you just talk to the judge, talk to the court, resolve the dispute. So there's a rule there. So I think it's important for the professionals in this circle to somehow resolve issues to rules.
Steve Saunders:
Absolutely. Huawei has had incredible success over the last few years, and congratulations to you personally and to your team for playing such a vital role in that success. It's been very exciting to watch.
Alan Fan:
I can see at the beginning we were not really focusing on IP, but the articles you write about IP and write about the company is getting a lot more sophisticated. So you're becoming an IP expert.
Steve Saunders:
Well, no. I mean, I don't think I would describe myself as an expert, but I was inspired to file some of my own patents for various ideas. We'll have to talk about that separately.
Alan Fan:
Okay.
Steve Saunders:
Yeah.
Alan Fan:
Off the camera?
Steve Saunders:
If you promise not to laugh.
Alan Fan:
No, no. I thought the idea was an amazing idea.
Steve Saunders:
It is a good idea. We're not going to tell these people about it. No, thank you.
Alan Fan:
Okay. Thank you.